But I'm on Heme/Onc Peds right now. Which of course we have many patients on long term chemotherapy, study regimens, experimental drugs, etc. And a few have simply decided that they don't want to be bothered by medical students. They refuse to let them in their rooms or talk to them or whatever. Even to the point where some patients have put up "no med student" signs. Needless to say, this really bugs the shit out of me.
Why? Lets put aside for a second the UNGODLY amount of money I'm paying in order to be exposed to patients and for clinical learning. But these people came to a TEACHING hospital. Meaning they are getting the benefit of having an entire team mull over their case every day. They get to be in a research hospital where new and better treatments are being investigated. And where they get the benefit of having free treatment in many cases. But when it comes to returning the favor.... by letting others learn to potentially benefit others... they refuse. Stating that it's too bothersome to have multiple people in the room or multiple questions asked every day.
And what really pisses me off is that many attendings simply adhere to these requests and refuse to let us in. Which burns me even more.
Usually, I agree in situations like this. But I think if your child has cancer and is sufferimg a lot, you should be allowed a pass. I can't imagine anything sadder.
ReplyDeleteAnd presumably, they do talk to residents so they're still participating in the training process.
People are stupid and major jack asses sometimes Stay strong anyway
ReplyDeleteSpeaking from experience as a peds patient in the oncology ward at a teaching hospital you don't want to have medical students in your room 20X a day re-doing exams that the attending already did earlier. It sucks, you already feel like death, and then you have to share it with 15 more people. It was really hard for me because I was 14/15, and I want to be a doctor, and its sort of embarrassing to have medical students watch you throw up. I would never put a sign up like that, but I can understand it. Maybe take another look at it from the eyes of a sick and bald child.
ReplyDeleteI can understand it too. Watching a child suffer the ravages of cancer in pain and not understanding, "Why me?" the last thing you want is a curious med student watching. It's not personal against you, it's personal to them.
ReplyDeleteSpeaking as a 3X cancer patient (once as a child), I have to say - you're wrong. It's not about you - EVER. That may be the most important lesson you can learn on this rotation. I T ' S N E V E R A B O U T Y O U - Good for the attendings who get it and back up the patients.
ReplyDeleteAlso - consider a case I know of - an infant was in the hospital - the med students were super-psyched to be able to log a "clean catch" urine specimen procedure - so much so - that a PARADE OF THEM stabbed that child in the abdomen throughout the day - FOR NO THERAPEUTIC or DIAGNOSTIC REASON! When the mother put a stop to it, rescinded permission - 2 rogue students waited until she stepped away AND DID IT ANYWAY - they were removed from the program.
Then there are the well-documented (really - google it) cases of, again, a PARADE of med students doing UNNECESSARY pelvic exams on women under anesthesia (without specific informed consent) - strictly for the "experience." Sick and twisted. What does this teach med students - right - patients don't matter. They're really just there as teaching tools.
I applaud your drive to become a doctor. I understand the sacrifices you have made and the dedication required to achieve your goal. Once again - it's not about you - it's about the patient. Learn it. Love it. Live it. Or, find another profession.
"But these people came to a TEACHING hospital. Meaning they are getting the benefit of having an entire team mull over their case every day."
ReplyDeleteThey may not have had a choice in the hospital. They may not have understood what it means to be in a teaching hospital. They may have been lied to (it happens - especially surgeons) by the attending about the involvement of students/residents in their child's care. The attendings are expected to recruit paying patients to the hospital.
You don't know what has occurred prior to you coming on board. The parent may have seen too many med students sticking their child unnecessarily - or poorly - in short - you just don't know the individual circumstances of the individual humans on the ward. This may be an opportunity for you to learn a different lesson from the one you expected. It might be an opportunity to learn how to interact compassionately with humans during a difficult time in their lives.
There's so little a parent can control when their child is seriously ill. Controlling access may be the one thing they have to hold on to.
It sucks that it seems like you're being denied learning opportunities. Yes, you're paying a lot of money to be there - but the patients aren't there as learning tools - they're there to get well.
Thank you to everyone who has said a variation of what I wanted to say: it's not about you. I love this blog and reading of your adventures but I don't agree with your stance here at all.
ReplyDeleteIf one is already going through a tumultuous time such as dealing with cancer... I can completely understand why they wouldn't want to be bothered all day. I don't know if I'd do it so rudely as some... but I get it.
Well maybe I'm wrong. I'll do some thinking on it.
ReplyDeleteWhenever there are med students in KayTar's ped's office, I'm MORE than happy to have them come in and practice on us...BUT, if KayTar was inpatient and miserable and nearing the end of her life? I'd be less inclined to do so. Not because I don't value medical education (I do!), but because she would be my priority and one more set of eyes and probing hands might not be best for her.
ReplyDeleteIs this a joke? Ella - Queen of Semi-Anonymity - you're kidding right? This is too genius as a joke to not actually be a joke. You do need a little work on your conjunction usage, but the content is pure gold. Keep up the good work!
ReplyDeleteHm. Is what a joke? Sorry I'm not following....?
ReplyDeleteI had sort of an opposite experience. As a older pediatric oncology patient who had to stay in the hospital for extended periods of time, I actually welcomed everyone coming in during rounds...it was some of the attendings who, for my sake, decided that during flu season they would discuss outside of the room (even though everyone was required to wear masks when entering a patient's room) and then the attending only would come in to talk to me despite my repeated requests to have everyone come in. To me, that deprives the students of an educational experience.
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